The Depths of Mordor
(Dazed and Confused DSB’s the Finals)
Well, I don’t know about you but I, for one, had a fantastic time last night! What an awesome night of music, and I’m very sad (and yes, a bit relieved) that’s it’s all over.
Of course, I understand the disappointment that many of you are feeling, but there was a shocking amount of outrage, which surprised me. I will never understand the fury of some of the fans. It’s a competition based on subjective opinions, upon which there will never be a consensus, which is the only possible way for it to be, so I never quite discern from where all the anger is coming.
For those of you, you know, normal people—who have understandable confusion and a healthy amount of disappointment (as opposed to unbridled rage) because their favorite bands did not do as well as they wanted, just hang in there and I will explain, to the best of my ability, what happened and why.
Let’s begin with the story’s headline – “Dazed and Confused DSB’s the Finals.” By “DSB’s the Finals,” I’m referring to the Journey tribute, Don’t Stop Believin’, which veteran UMC fans will know, was the band who might have taken it away from Rolling the Stones last year. In fact, all three judges had them as being a favorite going into the Finals.
Alas, DSB booked a bunch of gigs over the weekend and the singer, Juan, had all but blown out his voice, plummeting them from a heavy favorite to the clear bottom position and why I now call these situations a “DSB moment.” And man, I can’t believe it happened again! Dazed and Confused, dudes! We begged you not to do that. We told all the bands, on the blog and on the mic, “rest your voices! Take the weekend off. There’s tons of money on the line, please!”
In my mind, they were the clear frontrunners. After one of the most memorable performances in UMC history, when they played the eight-minute epic, “Since I’ve Loving You,” I was sure Dazed and Confused would win first or second place. But when I ran into singer Jason in the V Lounge before the doors opened, and he told me he played four gigs over the weekend, I became concerned.
When they opened with “Nobody’s Fault,” it was evident there were going to be issues, especially with vocals. “Over the Hills and Far Away” was a good choice, but also troublesome. Ditto “Ramble On” which started off like it was going to happen, but they couldn’t seem to connect with it, as if they were lost in a dark forest of death and despair and couldn’t find their way out. Actually, it was a section of the lyrics of “Ramble On” that underscored the situation.
“T’was in the darkest depths of Mordor….” Jason sang, and yes, it occurred to me, that’s exactly where we were – where the band was – in Mordor, JRR Tolkien’s fictitious netherworld which he described as “a dying land, but not yet dead. . . with coarse grey grass-tussocks, withered mosses and great writhing, tangled brambles.”
“The Ocean,” was another great set choice, but they were to deep in the thicket of Mordor now; there was very little they could do except wander through it aimlessly. I felt bad for them. I could see in their eyes they knew it was a miss.
The finale, their namesake, “Dazed and Confused,” had moments of pure brilliance, and the breakdown would’ve been goose-pimple inspiring – especially Joe’s guitar and bow action, and the call and answer between vocals and guitar – but, in order for a breakdown, or “come down” to deliver its full effect, it has to come down from a higher place. We have to have been emotionally soaring in order for the free fall plummet of a breakdown to do its magic on us. Alas, there was no great height from which to fall.
Of course, not everyone agreed. After the announcements were made, we had people coming up in droves to rant about Dazed getting screwed, like the drunk guy who was calling Alicia the B-word, or the ignoramopatomus who told me I had my head up my ass because Dazed had played a “perfect” set, or the funniest one of them all, a young woman – let’s call her Mad Girl – who approached the judges’ table and ranted maniacally for a good three minutes. (For your pleasure, I have transcribed her rant at the bottom of this post).
And so it went, with a lot of angry Dazed supporters, and other angry fans of other bands, giving us healthy doses of what for. And you know what? We can argue all day about which of the top three bands deserved which of the first three slots. I have heard convincing arguments for every possible ranking. And, to be totally honest, if I were an audience member, the rankings of the top three could have been rearranged in any order and I’d have had no problem with it. The differences in skills and execution level were so close; it came down to minutia and bias and which mistakes were or weren’t noticed by the judges. The only thing about which I am dead certain is how it turned out for Dazed and Confused.
The other judges concurred. We actually agreed on just about everything. We all had the same bands in the same order on our scoresheets, so I feel pretty good about how it went down, despite the angry reactions. Because, I noticed, most of the really furious fans, the ones who were inconsolable to the point of mental disease, all pretty much did the same thing. They were all able to point out the mistakes and missteps of their rival bands, but somehow neglected to notice the mistakes of their favorite band.
Because, yes, Super Magnetic was at times screechy and mussed up “Love Rollercoaster”; yes, Radio Karma flubbed “Hungry like a Wolf” and growled excessively on “Come Together”; and yes, Metallica messed up “Nothing Else Matters” and had periodic pocket issues—there were plenty of hiccups to go around. So, what made me decide which band to put in which slot? Here it is, boiled down two simple simple sound bytes for easy consumption.
1. The primary reason that I gave Super Magnetic the ever-so-slight edge over Radio Karma was because SM’s flub (“Rollercoaster of Love”) was not as bad as RK’s flub (“Hungry Like the Wolf”).
2. And the reason I gave Radio Karma the ever-slight-edge over Damage Inc. is because Radio Karma’s finale, “One More Try,” was more brilliant than Damaged Inc’s most brilliant moment (“Seek and Destroy”).
And for those who want to say, well, you don’t like Metallica music I say this. If when I die, they send me to a room in Hell in which I must listen to only one band, over and over and over again, for eternity, and I must chose between George Michael and Metallica-you can darn well know I’d have to choose Metallica.
George Michael music typically provokes my gag reflex, but Radio Karma’s performance was spectacular. Reegeeo straight up gave me chills. It was his “Since I’ve Been Loving You” moment because it was such a dangerous, powerful, perfectly executed musical and emotional journey, one which I will never, ever forget. Of course, Damage Inc. had plenty of moments of brilliance as well. And I know and understand why they are bewildered. In fact, shortly after Mad Girl finished her rant on me, Chris Brightwell, guitarist for Damage, came up and told me, in the politest, humblest most professional manner possible, that he was astonished by the decision, that they thought they would’ve at least made second place, which I totally understand. All I can say, Chris, is that I felt Radio Karma’s performance in a rare and special way. But it in no way diminishes the brilliance of who you guys are and what you do. Because you and your band are gods of rock. You, in particular, blew me away. But more importantly, you are a solid, stand up dude. I love your attitude. You could’ve dwelled on the notion that you got robbed, but instead, you put it in the right compartment – the que sera compartment – and didn’t let it hold you hostage, nor hold it against us, which is just fantastic. It is an honor to know you, and your band – all of whom I would just love to get to know better, and hang out with some more.
And that goes for the rest. I have seriously grown to love and respect you, as people, and as musicians. I want to be friends with you all, want to come out to your shows, want to drink Rumple Mintze with you (thank you Colleen for the correct spelling of that) and basically just hang with all the people who have taken this 11 week long road trip to Rocklanta.
As Tony said last night, “It takes an army of people to make this thing work. It takes the bands, the fans, the stage crew, the bar staff, the tribe, the sponsors, The Mad Girls and of course, you guys, the Bloglodytes, my favorite people on Earth – we are all that army. So march on people. See you on the flip side.
RANDOM INTERVIEWS – As you may have noticed, last night I was walking around with a tape recorder interviewing fans, musicians, contestants, employees etc. about various topics. Here are some excerpts:
BEFORE SHOW BEGAN
1. Brad (bald bartender at Dreamcatcher): I’m pulling for Dazed and Confused. I’m an old Zeppelin fanatic though, so I’m biased.
Ed: So, take your bias out of the equation, who do you think?
Brad: I think this is the best competition we’ve had so far, and all the bands are so great, anyone can win, but again, I’m pulling for the boys.
2. Gilbert (standing in line just before doors open): It’s going to be Super Magnetic.
3. Gilbert’s wife: I don’t know, the judges like the harder stuff. It’s their age group.
4. Olin (husband to The Ornery One): I like Radio Karma and Super Magnetic.
Ed: Who do you think will win?
Olin: I think either of the rockers will win because the judges like rockers.
5. Jason (Dazed and Confused singer, who I ran into at V-Lounge before doors opened):
Ed: What’s going on in your mind right now before the show?
Jason: Trying to have nothing go through my mind before the show – that’s the key
Ed: What’d you think about the event as a whole?
Jason: It was an amazing experience. Win or lose, it was a great thing to be a part of.
6. Willow (my wife, sitting at V-Lounge before show, after talking to Jason of Dazed and Confused): It’s going to be Damage, Dazed, Super Magnetic and Radio Karma
Ed: Why?
Willow: Damage Inc. is perfect at what they do. Super Magnetic is good but will probably flub up somewhere. Jason not going to have his chops because he just got done saying he played four gigs over the weekend and Radio Karma always does something to screw themselves up.
Dave Patrone (Judge #1): I think every band will come in 3rd and whoever does the unexpected will come in 4th or 1st. I think Dazed and Confused were morons to play four shows before this one. Unless they were for a lot of money, like 10 grand a piece or something. You need to protect your voice when you’re doing that kind of singing.
8. Sergio (Monsters of Rock guitarist and all-round swell guy): Damaged Inc. will win. I love those guys, played with them a bunch of times. Also, Dazed and Confused, those are awesome guys too. So if any of those two bands win I’ll be happy…
Ed: Any suggestions about what to improve for next year?
Sergio: At this point I wouldn’t really change anything. It’s going really good with the caliber of the bands, the honesty of the judges, the inclusion of the audience, the blog is what makes it exciting because you get to see that feedback and hear all those opinions.
AFTER THE WINNERS WERE ANNOUNCED
1. Tris (fellow bloglodyte and UMC friend and fan): I was here to support Damage, but the other three were amazing too. I tried to hold still but I couldn’t help it. They were all amazing.
2. Jason: (Damaged fan and UMC fan, has attended UMC4 every single week): The outcome was ok. I didn’t necessarily agree with Damage being in third place. I thought they should have at least come in second. There was a lot of screaming at the end for Super Magnetic. Radio Karma was tight – they belong in top two.
3. Blue (fan, in the V-Lounge, after the after party): I liked the Zeppelin band. I think they were original.
Ed: Original?!
Blue: Yeah
Ed: But they’re a cover band?!
Blue: Well, that’s my opinion
Ed: Original? You sure about that?
Blue: Yes
Ed: Ok, well, you’re entitled.
4. Alicia (Judge #2, in an Instant Message on Monday morning): The whole drive home I kept thinking if I should’ve pushed harder for Radio Karma.
Ed: I might’ve given them the win too if it weren’t for the Duran Duran song.
Alicia, Yeah, I hated “Hungry Like a Wolf,” but I also thought Super Magnetic was sloppy in their first three songs.”
Ed: I wouldn’t say “sloppy” I would just say they were not as tight as usual.
What was your problem with Damage?
Alicia: My problem with Damage was completely technical. The vocals were the weakest I’ve heard by them so far. Also, I had some issues with the drummer playing consistently behind the beat, while the other 3 guys were on top of it. It didn’t gel, especially in the last tune. Chris’s solos, however, were jaw dropping. I was so, so impressed by him and by the band’s energy and showmanship. But in the end, there was only one performance [“One More Try”] when the singer completely committed himself physically and emotionally to the song. What I felt from Reegeeo was 100% real. He was wiping away tears. It was so, so moving.
5. And finally, the rant you’ve all been waiting for – Mad Girl:
Mad Girl approached the judges’ table and raged for about a minute before I stopped her and said, “Hold on a second, let me record this for the blog,” to which she readily agreed. So I pulled out my recorder, turned it on, and she went off. What follows is a hilarious combination of inappropriate rage, awkward word usage and a grand finale accusation of racism that is beyond bizarre. I bring you now, in its entirety, with no commercial interruptions – The Mad Girl Outburst:
“I think the judging of this entire contest was bullshit,” she begins, already pretty good and worked up.
“Because Dazed and Confused have talent and know how to play their instruments,” she said sarcastically, as if none of the other bands have talent or can play their instruments.
“Their singer sounds so much like the singer of Led Zeppelin that …”
At this point she’s working herself into a frenzy. She begins splitting her sentences so that she could accent (read: shout) more words to get her point across.
“It’s ridiculous
That anybody
Could POSSIBLY. . . ”
And now she’s screaming, her eyeballs are about to explode out of their sockets:
“. . . NOT PUT DAZED AND CONFUSED AS THE FIRST PLACE WINNER IN THIS F__ING CONTEST!”
Then she calms down a bit, takes a breath.
“They were so good. They had the entire crowd going. I was here from the beginning, . . . ”
She’s getting agitated again and returns to talking in half-sentences:
“. . . From the start
Every band
I listened
every single tune…
To every single instrument…
To every single voice…
Possible note
of every singer . . .”
and now she’s outright yelling, red faced, bug-eyed, voice.
“. . . And there was only one!
Who hit every f__ing note!
Of every f___ing song!
Had the entire crowd going!
They f__ing rocked this place!
They ruled
This is all bullshit!”
And here comes her coup de grace – her encore:
“And, as a matter of fact
I think it’s racial!
It’s racial because the last band
happened to be
Grooving the place with the R&B,
like every other thing in the f___ing world.”
And wow, wow, wow. There is just so much going on in that outburst. And what on Earth does that last part even mean? They were “grooving the place with R&B just like every other thing in the world,” as if the world has a problem with too much R&B grooving, like you go to the grocery store and they’re grooving on R&B all day, then over to gramma’s who is grooving R&B on her Victrola , or your listening to Rock 105.3 and they’re playing groovy R&B version of Metallic music. Oh Mad Girl, don’t you know how grateful I am to have people like you in my world? The joy you bring me, the laughter – oh, please marry me Mad Girl, be my brain-dead bride?
[Author’s Note: While it is fun to have a chuckle at people like Mad Girl, it should be noted that she is not a Dazed and Confused fan, at least not until last night, and even if she was a fan, it has no bearing on the guys in the band who are great, awesome, cool, respectful and insanely talented fellows. Hope there are no hard feelings guys. Respect!].
There are 323 Comments to "The Depths of Mordor
(Dazed and Confused DSB’s the Finals)"
Chris– I just read this whole link, and all I can say is: WOW!! This is gonna have people going until the NEXT UMC!!! Who wants to start??………
I am referring to the last page’s link that ‘Chris’ posted…there’s some interesting stuff to discuss!!
Yeah, I’ll say, Renee. He called me out on more than one occasion as well, as well as my fellow judges, and the contest as a whole so I feel the need to respond. If I do, I’ll let you know. Did you leave a comment over there?
Who wants to start?!?! I’ll start!
First of all, I don’t have much respect for someone who issues those “opinions” on a different “web site” and doesn’t have the huevos to come onto the site where it’s all happened. But instead chooses the cowardly way out to bad-mouth on a site where probably most of the people who are those who think simarly to him. OMG heaven forbid if anyone should think differently than he.
I don’t have the time right now to really get into all the mis-statements and untruths that were mentioned in that “post” over there. And due to the fact that it is on a different web site, it’s hard to remember all the things that I’d like to mention. Perhaps I’ll voice my opinion more tomorrow when I have more time. But quickly a few responses from me.
To the statement that no metal has walked away with money…Go back to UMC3 and check out how much $$ Monsters of Rock walked away with.
To the statement that bands should not be admitted unless they have previous gigs…Why? They still have to bring it and do well.
To the statements about the judges…don’t have time for all I have to say about that! HMD…YOU should do some researching before all your statements!
Have to go for now, but check back tomorrow night for my full comments of the inane comments from Heavy Metal Dave (HMD)! Geeze! Do your homework before spounting accusations!
That said, I fully support your right to your opinion, but why don’t you put up here where all can see it rather than hiding behind another place?? Huh? Ok you’ve definately gotten me riled up…. and if you do some research from previous UMC blogs, including this year’s, I don’t tend to sit by and just let things like this pa** by.
~~Peace (anyway)
Colleen, thanks a million on bringing a lot more readers to my web site. I need the traffic.
HeavyMetalDave
Ya know? When I was writing the previous post about your “web site”, I was wondering if this was a ploy to create some hits on his/her inate, cowardly “site”. Looks like my wondering was correct. Well played. But I still have extremely little respect for you that you choose to reside in the shadows of some amateur web place s/he calls a “web site”.
If you were a true “journalist” as cited by Rosie below, then you would not be so afraid to post your opinions on this web site where fans of ALL genres could read them and either agree or disagree with you. But I understand your unwillingness to step up to the plate and be brave enough to hear what others have to say. Some people simply cannot take constructive criticism. And I support your right to cower at a separate site where you can be safe.
~~Peace.
Well said, Colleen!
Some clarification on the band history. We were part of a pilot project for a show on the Wealth TV network that was shelved shortly after a 2 month long development deal. 4 of the members of the band have played together for over 5 years in a band called “Diva Soul” in which we have played coutless hundreds of private functions, casino, and club gigs. As that band has languished in the rough economy, we decided to get behind the TV lineup and promote the name Super Magnetic. Super Magnetic’s full lineup played a few private functions before the UMC, but to be honest we only entered the UMC as a means to get some exposure and break into the scene. Starting a ten piece band is not as easy as calling up some musician buddies and putting out some charts. But you are entitled to your opinion on what makes “real musicians.”
Mr. Mo–No worries there! You guys were totally awesome and you ARE fantastic musicians, and you definitely deserved the WIN!! What better place to ‘get some exposure’ than the UMC!!! I would come see your band anywhere,anytime!! I hope to see your band again in SD soon!
No, I didnt…I was waiting until this morning when I had a clear head so I didn’t tear into the guy!! I could not believe that stuff he wrote!! What a jerk!! Well, ‘Chris’ posted it, but it was from a guy named Metal Head Dave or something like that…do you know who that is?? Grrr!
And, Colleen– I completely agree with you !! When I was reading that c-r-a-p I thought my head was going to explode!! I haven’t been involved in the UMC’s too long, but, it’s been long enough to where I KNOW the rules, judges, and who won!! HMD’s take on it all is clearly b***s—,and ANYONE who’s been to the UMC’s more than once KNOWS the deal.
I wish the guy had posted his mouthy words HERE instead of some other column, so I could refer to things he said. I, too, would tell him a thing or two. But, I guess, when you are such a coward that you can’t post your ‘thoughts’ about the contest and the contest judges ON the contest BLOG, then, you hide behind some rag…come out where we can see you!!!
Chris, this is very interesting what HeavyMetalDave has written here,
http://heavymetaldave.wordpress.com/2010/06/21/ultimate-music-challenge-2010-–-part-ii/
He is quite a detailed journalist; looks like Ed may have finally met his match!
This information gives a band something to really think about, before considering competing in UMC next year. Looks like he clearly has a valid point and owns up to what he believes here.
HeavyMetalDave has the same right to voice his opinion just like the rest of you do right here on this blog.
I think a lot of bands that played in the UMC competition this year feel this way, they are just not willing to deal with being trashed on this blog because, if they voice their opinions on how they really feel, you leave yourself open to be insulted by the judges and their ‘host of friends’ or should I say the judges’ posse, this seems to be the protocol here.
EVERYONE is entitled to their own opinion, but, I do not agree with what you OR HMD have said. He seems to be very harsh with his words, and I do not agree with him at all.. Just MY opinion! ( and btw–I do NOT consider myself to be part of a ‘posse’, just a happy ‘blogodyte’!!
Rosie! I couldn’t agree more with you in your statement that HMD, “…has the same right to voice his opinion just like the rest of you do right here on this blog.” So why doesn’t he post here? Afraid that someone else might disagree with him? Appears that way.
BTW…there have been several bands who have voiced their opinion on this blog and have not agreed with the way the contest is presented. And believe it or not, they have all survived the comments both pro and con. And all have my respect for speaking up, even when they have chosen to disagree with others, including me. It’s too bad that HMD has cast such an opinion of unacceptance of other genres other than metal. Had it not been for this contest, I would have never obtained an appreciation for the musical value heavy metal has in the music arena. And for that appreciation, I thank “Monsters of Rock” and “Alice and the Cooper Gang” who have played in this competition.
Even most bands who have not advanced past the first round have overwhelmingly enjoyed the chance to perform on the DreamCatcher (DC) stage with the awesome lights and sound that have been provided. Several bands have come back and told me that, due to the fact they got the opportunity to play at the DC, they have gotten gigs they may have never been able to have obtained. Granted, I a s s ume that there are a few who had bad experiences, but as the old saying goes, you can’t please all the people all the time.
One more thing… you say that you, “…think a lot of bands that played in the UMC competition this year feel this way…” I’d like to know the names of said bands. But I respect your integrity in not naming any of them without their permission.
Thanks for stating your opinions on this blog. You show that you are brave enough for all to hear your opinion. Good for you!
~~Peace!
Colleen,
Jeeze, I have posted here many times. I have posted the link to my web site here and posted the links to my blog posts to the UMC4 Facebook site. Not sure what more you want me to do. It’s not my fault you just now discovered it.
I’m not a cowered or what ever else you have been calling me. But it seems you have be lowering yourself to my level when I wrote those posts. So it seems we are pretty much the same. I had a lot to say and that is what my blog is for and my blog is pretty popular, not many people even know about this one. My blog has even been in the San Diego Reader.
It’s been a month since all this crap happened and I have moved on to better things, maybe you all should too.
Over and out.
Right on! And by the way, in his article he supposes that he will never hear from us again… au contraire mon frere… au contraire.
haha!! You rock, Mr. Mo!!!!
Note to Ed:
I went down to the horse nearby and he says he’s not taking sides. He wants to remain neutral on this topic! But of course he is a gelding so maybe that’s whyhe won’t chime in like you other guys!
where’s ED?
I think it only fair that there is a Blog that is adverse to this one-sided UMC Blog here.
I don’t see the need for HeavyMetal Dave or any band to come on this blog and voice an opinion and be attacked by people who are clearly here as “Supporters or “blogodytes’! (Colleen and Renee there is a pattern here you two are die hard bloggie supporters) of the judges and, what has now appeared to be a contest that seems to be as HeavyMetalDave has said ’smells very fishy!
Funny you haven’t heard one word from the Female singer of Supermagnetic not even a Thank You,, oh I just remembered she also won last year in Siren’s Crush! – aroma smells pretty bad…… The same bands seem to be recycled every year – I believe I have seen it stated here on this Blog 3rd time entering the UMC is a charm regarding this contest.
Renee are you serious ?-He seems to be very harsh with his words, HMD is by far not as “harsh and offensive as your Blog Leader ” some of the things I have seen written here about some of the bands are rude, offensive and downright unkind, and uncalled for.
Has there ever been a band that has won, that is not San Diego based, I’m just asking?
HeavyMetal Dave’s website will make you at least think about the entering a UMC competition, especially if you are not a favorite that has occasional drinks with the people who are judging you. I’m just saying?
Actually Rosie, we have healthy debate on here all the time and if HMD really wanted to participate in debate or express his opinions thoughtfully to people who were actually in the arena, this is the appropriate venue to do it, where the people he would defame are available to defend themselves and are accustomed to posting here. I don’t know how long you’ve been following this blog but the judges get beat up on a regular basis here and by no means is this blog “one sided” as you say
I absolutely defend his right to rant about whatever he wants wherever he wants whenever he wants; however, since we are so accessible here and his beef is with us, it seems appropriate that he would post his opinions here. I also reserve the right to defend myself from any of his posts and on this forum we do that as well. On his blog, he has the power to allow or disallow or even edit any of the posts that appear on his blog. Since I haven’t seen any positive posts or any type of dissenting discussion on HMD’s blog it would be easy to a**ume he’s not allowing those to appear. I’ve submitted two posts so far that still haven’t shown up on his blog yet…
David Patrone
http://www.davidpatrone.com
The question has been asked, “Where’s Ed” regarding the recent brouhaha that was ignited by the discovery of Heavy Metal Dave’s somewhat perturbed blog. The answer to that question is, I’m here, reading it all and soaking it in. I have already corresponded with HMD via email and am now mulling over my response (read: procrastinating).
Look for my response sometime today or tomorrow. There is, as you might have guessed, a lot I want to say…
In the meantime, much love Bloglodytes (yes, that means you too Rosie and HMD – a UMC Bloglodyte is any person who comes in here and makes more than one post, regardless of what opinions are expressed within. It’s about participation, not point of view–but we’ll get into that later, when I respond. Until then…
PEACE!
(And by Peace, I don’t mean, stop bickering, I mean, don’t wage actual war unnecessarily. By all means, keep bickering. After all that, that’s what BLOG stands for:
Bicker
Lament
Object and
Gripe
My four favorite things.
I posted two comments on HMD’s blog and they are still “awaiting moderation.” I’m interested to see if my comments are approved since I noticed that despite many of our supporters speaking out on this blog, I have yet to see a UMC Judge’s supporter’s post on his blog. I can’t believe that people like Colleen or other outspoken folks on this blog haven’t tried to post comments there and it would be a shame if that’s the kind of journalist he is.
apparently my comments are still “awaiting moderation”
another reason why HMD should have posted his comments here, we actually moderate our blog…
DP
Rosie– just for the record–yes, I AM a “blog supporter”, but, that does NOT mean that I agree with everything the judges do or say! I have my own opinion of the UMC, the bands, and the fans, and sometimes I dont agree with any of it, and other times I DO….
I just left a comment on HMD’s blog..it was ‘awaiting moderation’, so I dont know it was posted there or not. I will go back later to see……
HMD — I didn’t call you a “cowered” (note to Lisa…see? I’m not the only one who can misspell!). I said that the METHOD in which you stated your opinions seemed cowardly to me. If you truly wanted others to hear you and know how you feel, then you would have mentioned it here in this blog where all of whom you are referring would be reading. To me you are choosing to cower (or hide) behind YOUR blog where you can be in control of what is posted.
Also, you stated that you have posted on this blog several times and listed your link several times. You made the statement, “…It’s not my fault you just now discovered it.” To all your comments I say you are incorrect in your a s s umptions. I have noticed your past postings. I have noticed your links posted. I simply did not find it worthy of my time to explore the links until now.
Rosie — I am an avid participant of this blog. If that makes me a “…bloggie supporters…” then I guess I am and do not find that to be a negative thing. I am willing to voice my opinion on a blog where there might be others who do not agree with me and am willing to have them say so for all to hear.
Mr. Patrone — I agree with all you said about how it is so much more appropriate for HMD to submit his comments here rather than on his blog, since this is the site where it all “happened”. And Rosie should research a bit to see how you and I, you and others have not always seen eye-to-eye. In fact we have often not seen eye-to-eye. But that doesn’t mean that we both don’t have valid opinions to offer.
As to my posting on HMD’s “web site”? No I have not posted there and do not intend to post there. That site, in my opinion, is not worthy of my time to comment there where I may or may not be posted and is run by a person who, IMO, is rather narrow-minded.
Lastly to both Rosie and HMD. I appreciate your comments that are posted here on this site and that have to do with the UMC competition. I don’t agree with most of your comments, but the UMC does better when everyone is heard. Even if other people don’t agree. Yes, this blog does get hard in which to participate. I have been the target of many slings and arrows aimed at me. As have all the judges, including those who did not judge in UMC4. Have the judges made incorrect “judgments”? Probably. Have I made incorrect “judgments”? Probably. But the discussions that have been created here have always been interesting to say the least!
~~Peace!
Heavy Metal Dave:
It’s been several days since I’ve attempted to post to your blog and I’d like to encourage you to moderate the comments to your blog. I have heard from several people who’s comments are also “awaiting moderation.” Tardy moderation is a form of censorship. I feel that once you publish public comments on a blog, let alone criticism about a person or institution, you shouldn’t censor feedback. The nature of blogging encourages comments and debate. It would be fair to let any person respond publicly to your statements. With criticism, comes a responsibility to allow rebuttal. I think that discussion is healthy and I’m interested in opening a public dialog with you since you’ve made some provocative statements about the way I conduct myself. We judges have been emphatic about allowing all comments on the UMC blog. I can a**ure you we do not delete, censor or edit posts and we have received plenty of public criticism as well as praise for the job we’ve done. We’d appreciate the same type of treatment from you on your blog. I think it’s a fundamental component of our country and the Internet in general that you should avoid censorship and allow opinions and criticism to flourish if you ever wish to truly and empathetically share your opinion and create understanding.
David Patrone
http://www.davidpatrone.com
Speaking of censorship, we have no control over the words getting astericked out in words like “a**ume” and “p**ential.” We fought to have those filters removed but to no avail. certain words are filtered by the program and we have no control over it as silly as it looks and even draws MORE attention to infractions that would normally go unnoticed. This sort of censorship is beyond our control and I know I speak for almost everyone when I say I wish it weren’t there.
DP
I totally agree with your frustration regarding the astericks. I would have never paid any attention to the smaller word, “a s s” was in the word “a**ume”. But we all know what happens when one “a s s u m e s”!
Thanks for your continued attempt to gain some dialouge with HMD. Too bad he won’t step up to the plate and express a bit more fully as to why he feels the way he does.
Hopefully Viejas will fix it’s own “awaiting moderation” problems soon. At least the delays are not as long as HMD’s.
~~peace
Is ED no longer with us?
Yeah, Ed is here, Chris. I was actually working on a response to Heavy Metal Dave when Dave Patrone posted his tempered and thoughtful reaction to the gobbledy-g*** that was perpetrated by the blogger.
Dave touched on most of the things I wanted to say and so I started working on another post, which really just seemed like overkill at that point, especially since HMD is not even approving the comments.
I did, however, contact HMD after I was made aware of his post. He told me that he wrote the post in the heat of the moment, but that he stood by his comments. He also mentioned that he and his readers have moved on from the issue.
Here is what I wrote him in response (with minor edits so as not to conceal personal information shared by HMD) …
Dave, I really don’t mind you attacking my opinions, my credibility, my website, my spoken word, the judges’ blog and/or my writing. You are absolutely right when you say that, when I put myself out there as a judge, and a writer / entertainer, I open the doors for criticism and skepticism.
What I take issue with are the unfounded implications that the judges had a hidden agenda to choose Super Magnetic, or that we had reasons, other than the performances of the evening, that caused us to vote the way we voted.
That sort of unproven implication is the kind of thing that could damage our reputations (and/or careers) — another reason why I would never judge these bands based on anything other than the merits of their performance.
That’s the only thing I’m angry about–and I’m not all that angry, just, you know, I didn’t want the accusation to go unanswered. Of course, there are a lot of other things that you wrote that I disagree with, a lot of stuff you got wrong factually, and would’ve liked to have responded to them.
Just know this – we can disagree about which band performed better, but in MY head and heart, I thought Super Magnetic was the best. And, in response to your comment that everyone in the room agreed that Dazed kicked a**, that is absolutely false. Maybe the people YOU polled, who I am sure were largely Dazed and Confused fans, agreed with that. But the people I talked to were split. And I talked to a LOT of people:
There were a ton who thought Damaged should have won, a ton who thought Radio Karma should’ve won, a lot who thought we got it right and a lot who thought it shoulda been Dazed.
Bottom line, it’s a game of opinions and just because yours was different than mine doesn’t mean we had an ulterior motive – an accusation, by the way, we get every year.
Ed
Ed,
It’s nice that you’re being so civil to Heavy Metal Dave; but, I’m actually very disappointed at him for not allowing our comments to post on his blog. How dare he publish direct, accusatory comments about us, allow his same-thinking conspiracy shouters to pitch in, and then not allow us to reply to the post? What kind of a “journalist” does that? In my opinion it is one of the worst types of abuse of freedom of speech on the Internet and as a Marine who fought and gave up my own freedom for his right to print whatever he wants, I’m especially incensed that he doesn’t have the integrity or the courage to allow a rebuttal, yet allows other posters’ comments. Posting your opinion as some kind of editorial statement on a forum which doesn’t typically allow timely rebuttal is one thing; but, posting inflammatory accusations on the Internet that are search-able by anyone indefinitely and not approving rebuttals by us; yet, approving posts by others is unconscionable and I won’t be satisfied until I see my posts approved on his blog. In the meantime, I’ll probably post them below.
Heavy Metal Dave, If you are going to have a blog and trash people and make accusations about integrity, in FAIRNESS it seems to me that a person should be able to counter and make a statement on that blog. Ignoring your responsibility to open debate invalidates your opinions. It’s despicable to allow anyone to post comments EXCEPT for the people who you’ve trashed. I can’t remember the last time I was this disappointed in a blog “writer.” In fact, I’d be interested to meet with you or talk to you on the phone sometime to discover why you would justify ignoring your blog moderation. To most, the most obvious conclusions are that you’re either an intellectual coward or a simple rabblerouser who cares nothing about truth and consequently doesn’t possess a quarter of the integrity of the people whom you’ve maligned on your “blog.” If you tell me you’re just too lazy to moderate your own blog or you say you’re “over it” or you’ve “moved on” I think that’s even worse. It can’t be that you’re too busy ’cause you only have one blog post since the UMC post. If you really moved on and are “over it” and it doesn’t matter, then why don’t you just delete your blog post?
David Patrone
http://www.davidpatrone.com
Sorry if I have not gotten around to moderating comments on my site or posting here. Not that it’s anybodies business (Ed knows about this), since July 4th I have been in and out of the hospital 5 times and had two emergency surgeries. Worrying about UMC4 is not high on my priority list right now, recovering and getting healthy is.
Chris, Very good question?…Now there’s the ‘25 Thousand Dollar Question!
David Patrone, there is something to be said about you.
You are a gentleman, You are polite and somewhat kind, something rare on this blog that I have seen.
I have been there at the UMC, and you were the only judge that used tact and discretion when you spoke your comments about a band, Let’s break it down.
You have cla**! ….Maybe you should start your own blog, Then we can talk about ‘healthy debate’, and I am sure it would be much more professionally ran than this blog or the UMC has been this past year..
I still have to agree with HMD, Something smelt very fishy! and still does. There you go bloggies, I’m voicing my opinon again!
Finals still are not up yet, Funny it didn’t take nearly this long last year for the finals to be posted?